Allison Transmission Questions

Discussion in 'General RVing' started by AllisonMan, Apr 5, 2003.

  1. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Jimlin,
    Yes they are correct, once updated, you can not install your original calibration (CIN). The software automatically updates everything in the cal and the growl may have been cause from the cal or other problems. Allison is always updating the calibrations to make the transmissions work better. The shift points may have to adjust to your driving. Remember when you first bought the coach and the shifts were not right? It takes approx 2000 mile to get this calibration and ECU set up for you. It is constantly monitering your throttle and way you drive. The Allison dealer may have fast adapted the ECU but they drove it. When we test drive, we drive at full throttle to make the shifts. Please just give it a little time. I say good job to the shop if they repaired the either growl or vibration. These are the most difficult problems to solve. Thanks for the question and have a great day! :)
     
  2. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    VAN2001,
    1.WTEC III is the newer verion of software in the world transmission model. The physical changes that you would notice is the shifter only has one display that is red in the WTECIII where as in the WTECII there are two green displays on the shifter. The ECU's are also shaped different and WTECII has 2 harnesses and WTEC III has 3.
    2.The calibration (CIN) id number is what is engineered for the shift points to match up with the engine and differential plus vocation. What the ECU is looking for is a combination throttle position, engine, turbine and output speed.
    3.The only control the transmission has is torque converter ratios. It has nothing to do with throttle except to read what the electronic engine is giving it. (mechanical engines use a TPS (throttle position sensor)
    4.the shift pattern for a 6 speed (which is what all worlds are just the calibration tells you if 4,5,or 6 speed and no you cannot just change a 4 speed into a 6 speed because the driveline cannot handle the greater speed) is 1C (c=converter, L + lockup), 2C, 2L (which is the extra shift you feel in second), 3L, 4L, 5L and 6L.
    These were all great questions. Thank you and have a great day! :)
     
  3. van2001ko

    van2001ko New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Ah thanks for the in detil reasoning. Can this Lock up Gear have a different shaft point? Becouse for some reason buses on hills tends to get stuck in it going around 20mph.
    2. What is the highest speed can this lock up gear can kick in?
    3. Is it possible to have the B-400R-4 gears WTEC with Detriot Diesel 50 275hp engine to have it go up to 75mph?
    4.Why does the Newer Allision World transmission shaft at lower rpm's than the older Allision Worlds.

    Again, Thank you so much :)
     
  4. jimlin

    jimlin New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Thanks for your information. I truly appreciate your generosity of time and knowledge. jimlin
     
  5. Jody

    Jody New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Hi AllisonMan,

    I have a 93 Rockwood Embassy DP, 230 Cummins, MD3060 6 Spd. Took it out for a drive the other night, about 5 miles from home the "do not shift" light came on and the shifter pad went black. All of a sudden there was a pop beside me, saw sparks and smoke come up out of the box the ECU was in. We pulled over and shut off the engine. Then of course we had to be towed home. Pulled the ECU out and the boards are burnt black in one area about the size of a half dollar. Any suggestions on what could have caused this and how to save money on having it fixed. Couldn't believe the $2500 cost of the ECU.

    Thanks!
    Jody
     
  6. Lewis

    Lewis New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    :question:
    Hi AllisonMan,
    We have a Detroit Diesel engine with an Allison transmission that uses a Stone-Bennet electric/airshifter. Our coach was made in 1990 by Newell Coach of Miami Oklahoma. The shifter was rebuilt at Newell in 2002 shortly after we purchased the coach. We have been haveing problems again starting about six months ago. Newell told us the shifters need rebuilt every couple of years. I find this hard to believe, but here we are having problems again.

    At first the problem was intermittent but now occurs every time we have been on the road for even a hour. When we stop, if the transmission is put into neutral, it will not shift into gear. If we stop and attempt to put the transmission into reverse, it will not shift. If we hose off the shifter (under the coach) and cool it off we can then shift into gear.

    Can you help us solve this problem with out breaking the bank again?
     
  7. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    rbigrig,
    I too am sorry if I sounded upset. I was really just trying to explain why we replace instead of repair. The unit you are talking about though is not the ECU but the VIM which is a vehicle interface module. This is way less compliacted than the programned ECU. Freightliner doesn't even use this since it is an option.
    Keep me informed if you get into this business! Have a great day. :)
     
  8. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    richard.reed,
    Try turning economy off. If that does not work, please select the lower of the 2 gears and drive in that gear. What happens is manufacturers get request to go higher speeds and the gearing is set up for you to go 70-80 mph. These motorhomes have too tall of gears in them then if you drive legally and normal LOL. Let me know if either helps. Thanks and have a great day! :)
     
  9. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Hello dumperdave,
    Climbing hills will cause much heat with the AT545. This transmission does not have lock-up which in easy terms, runs the trans with engine. No lockup means you are driven through hydralics only which by using and putting a load (uphil and maybe a car?)causes friction through hydralics. I would recommend that if the light is coming on a lot now, to have the main pressure tested because by overheating (most lights come on in an overheat condition) you broke down the viscosity of the oil much quicker and thus could have cause internal damage. Just for having a beter feeling when you go on your next trip, have them change oil, flush cooler, after they pressure test. I am thinking you may have low pressure.
    Another suggestion is to add an additional oil to air cooler.
    Thanks and have a great day if I didnt ruin it. :)
     
  10. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    notlost,
    thank you for those kind words. These words are what keeps me going. Have a great day! :)
     
  11. 1997beaver

    1997beaver New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Hi Allisonman, I have a Beaver Monterey 1997 Cat 300 and MD3060 transmisson. Didn't get any info with it on the shift pad etc. It will do Oil check and codes, but i never see any lights red or green to deal with the economy mode?
    My first trip out (i was not driving) we were going up a long hill and the driver was holding pedal down. We keep going slower and slower and after a while the check engine lite came on. (hi water temp) I told him to shift down manually and this helped. We topped the hill and cooled down ok.
    I am guessing not knowing if I was in economy or not had something to do with it. Pressing harder on the throttle didn't seem to down shift it?

    also is there information on the normal speed at various rpm's?

    charlie
     
  12. GMCallways

    GMCallways New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Good day AllisonMan. I just bought a 2001 3\4 ton GMC with an allison tranny and think I have some problems. When I put the truck in tow\haul mode and go up any kind of incline (without a load) the tranny slips and jumps when going into 2nd gear and then catches. The SES light comes on and the truck is stuck in what seems like third gear and will not shift through any gears at all until I put it in Park and turn the truck off. When I restart it it will shift fine except for the SES light stays on. This doesent happen in normal mode, only in Tow\Haul. I took it to the local allison dealer and he hooked it up and it came back with the codes P0732 and P0700. He cleared the codes and told me that if it acts up again to bring it back. Well I had to try it again in T\H mode and sure enough it did it again. Can you tell me what I can do to fix this or if it needs to be overhauled. I also was reading about an after market shift kit for allisons that claims to fix these problems. Would you recomend this? Thanks for any advise.
     
  13. Bush70

    Bush70 New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Hi AllisonMan,
    I have a few problems I thought you might be able to help me with. I will start from the beginning and give you all the details that I can.
    I have a 1997 Allegro Bus with a 230 Cummins and a Allison MD3060. This is a mechanical engine.
    The first time I noticed a problem was when the engine brake would not come on. At that point it didn't seem to down shift like it used to. After turning the engine off and restarting everything was fine. A month or so later the same thing happened, again restart and all is well.
    A few months later and a few thousand miles later we were leaving a campground one morning and about a mile out stopped at a stop street when the buzzer went off and the Do Not Shift light comes on. It was then locked if a forward gear so we could still travel. I stopped a the first rest area, shut it off, started again and all is well. The codes at this time were, 45-21 56-22 43-21.
    This was at the end of last year so over the winter I decided to disconnect the engine brake from the Allison because I didn't like the second gear select and I thought it might have something to do with the transmission problem. I now use the brake manually. All was well for probably 3000 or 4000 miles. Now sometimes when I start I push the D or R and they just flash and the transmission is in neutral. Also, I can hear static in the radio after I push the buttons. Shut it off and usually on the first restart it is OK. Sometimes I have to restart a couple times but it is always OK. Also, when driving the transmission won't always downshift by it's self. I have to manually downshifting it. The code showing now is 21-12.
    When all is well it is perfect. The shifting and downshifting is right on. I believe it is an electronic problem but would appreciate you opinion and what ever help you can give me.
    Thanks
     
  14. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Hello Jimlin,
    Why are they even re-programing your ECU? This does not need to be done with an exchange rebuild. You can have the calibration updated but the shift points should not change. Thiswould cost around 500 extra dollars to do this though. Ask the guys why and plese let me know and maybe then I can explain. Thanks and have a great day! :)
     
  15. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    van2001ko,
    WTECIII is the second generation of the world transmission line. WTECII was first and you can tell by the shifter displayed both the gear selected and the gear attained. The ECU also was phsycally different. WTEC III only shows the gear you select. Now the new product is phase 4 which incorporates another model of Allisons LCT line. Look for it in 2005. Yes the select AND attained will be back!

    The programing (CIN NUMBER) is determined by Allison engineers (Hi Brent and Rick Allisons cal engineers look at this site too sometimes and I have to give a shout out LOL)who in turn work with the OEMs to determine which calibration is needed. It does control shift points.

    What controls acceleration is the torque converter ratio that is configured to the engine and differential gear ratios.

    The second shift you feel while in second gear is torque converter lockup (counting the shifts it is the second shift)I do not pay attention to the speedo but to the tach. The rpms are what determine shift points.

    I hope I answered all your questions. Thank you and have a great day! :)
     
  16. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Hello jody,
    Wow I have never heard of an ECU doing this. You must have a direct short close to the ECU and it bypasses your fuses unless there are no fuses which then I could understand why it burned. Yes I do know the ECUs are very expensive but at this time there is not a company that I am aware of that rebuilds these units. I hope you are back on the road! :)
     
  17. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Lewis,
    Unfortunatly this is the right information but it should last more than 2 years more like 5-7. What is most common is if yours is an air unit which most are, water gets into the shift cylinders and rusts the insides. I suggest when it is rebuilt next time, that the company also installs some time of water removal filter right before the air goes into the cylinders. This will help greatly for extended life of the stone bennette system. Thanks :)
     
  18. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    1997beaver,
    I suggest stopping by an Allison distributor and asking for the world transmission shifter pamphlet. This book gives all the information on your shifter and also the code list.
    Economy mode is this. If you drive over 80% throttle it will help. What it does is with economy on and 80% or higher, the transmission will shift at a lower rpm (just like you were only at 80%) Now this wont help most motorhome people because they usually drive around 60% throttle.
    Where this WILL help big time for all the normal drivers below 80% LOL is when you are climbing a hill. At this time yes you usually are at 100% throttle. This will really fix if you have a shift cycling problem (doesnt know which gear you want because when it shifts and your on big pull, you bring down engine rpm thus making it downshift then upshift then downshift etc)Also I tell customers when in a town or city going from light to light. Then you are at 100% throttle so the meanie behind you dont honk LOL. This will fix any shift cycling in town.
    as far as temp goes, I would install a temp gauge so you can keep tabs on temp, always a good thing as Martha stewart once said LOL
    Thanks and have a great day! :)
     
  19. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    GMCalloways,
    I do not recommend any shift kits at all since this will void any Allison warranty. It sounds like you have a stuck valve in the valve body and it needs to be checked. A bad solenoid could be the culprit also. Thanks :)
     
  20. AllisonMan

    AllisonMan New Member

    Allison Transmission Questions

    Bush 70,
    My guess is yout throttle position sensor (TPS) is broken off at your engine throttle lever. This happens on many motorhomes because of a non hardened pivot pin that hold this cable. Check next to your throttle lever on the engine itself and look for a rubber boot with a cable coming out. I bet it is not hooked to the throttle lever. Please let me know and have a great day! :)
     

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