dbarton291
Senior Member
Re: Allison Transmission Questions
That is correct.
That is correct.
Allison Transmission Questions
- Thread starter AllisonMan
- Start date
Triple E
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
After changing the oil in my MD3060 (1996), I decided to recheck the torque on the bolts around the filter covers. The torque setting = 45 ft/lb. The filter cover's and the bolts around the edge of the Channel Plate Assemble all torque just fine. Only 1/3 of them needed retorqued. But the bolts on the inner plate would not tighten. I gave them one full turn and was worried about turning them anymore. These bolts do, however, fill snug. I guess what I mean by snug, they are more than finger tight. Do I have problem or is this what is expected?
Thank you in advance....
After changing the oil in my MD3060 (1996), I decided to recheck the torque on the bolts around the filter covers. The torque setting = 45 ft/lb. The filter cover's and the bolts around the edge of the Channel Plate Assemble all torque just fine. Only 1/3 of them needed retorqued. But the bolts on the inner plate would not tighten. I gave them one full turn and was worried about turning them anymore. These bolts do, however, fill snug. I guess what I mean by snug, they are more than finger tight. Do I have problem or is this what is expected?
Thank you in advance....
jljeeper@msn.com
New Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
I had the same experience so I called Allison support. I was worried that something was stripped inside. Some of the bolts tightened down to a firm torque and some didn't. I was relieved to hear that some of these bolts are tappered threads and are access covers for some test probes or something of that nature. Anyhow they won't tighten down to a positive stop. I forgot the exact locations of them but I think they were diagonal from one another and there were several. I'm a little vague since it was nearly two years ago. It is completely normal. Hey what a resource this place is......
After reading again, I am not sure if we are talking about the same bolts. I am refering to the bottom of the transmission around the filter cover area.
I had the same experience so I called Allison support. I was worried that something was stripped inside. Some of the bolts tightened down to a firm torque and some didn't. I was relieved to hear that some of these bolts are tappered threads and are access covers for some test probes or something of that nature. Anyhow they won't tighten down to a positive stop. I forgot the exact locations of them but I think they were diagonal from one another and there were several. I'm a little vague since it was nearly two years ago. It is completely normal. Hey what a resource this place is......
After reading again, I am not sure if we are talking about the same bolts. I am refering to the bottom of the transmission around the filter cover area.
dbarton291
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
I'm not sure what you mean by the inner plate. There's bolts for the filter covers, bolts that attach the control module to the main case, and there's some pressure taps also.
I'm not sure what you mean by the inner plate. There's bolts for the filter covers, bolts that attach the control module to the main case, and there's some pressure taps also.
Triple E
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
Yes, we are talking about the same bolts. In my "3000 Product Family Service Manual" it calls the plate that the oil filter covers are bolted to the "Channel Plate Assembly".
From what I can tell, the Channel Plate Assembly is the base for the "Control Valve Assembly".
Hey thanks for you help. I sure like this site. -Steve
Yes, we are talking about the same bolts. In my "3000 Product Family Service Manual" it calls the plate that the oil filter covers are bolted to the "Channel Plate Assembly".
From what I can tell, the Channel Plate Assembly is the base for the "Control Valve Assembly".
Hey thanks for you help. I sure like this site. -Steve
Triple E
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
OK, I got this fancy service manual that tells me a lot about my MD3060. Except where to mount a remote temperature sensor. I found where the local one is for the computer but I want to be able to view the temperature from the driver seat. Can you help explain where the remote should be installed? Also, do you prefer an electrical type or capillary?
OK, I got this fancy service manual that tells me a lot about my MD3060. Except where to mount a remote temperature sensor. I found where the local one is for the computer but I want to be able to view the temperature from the driver seat. Can you help explain where the remote should be installed? Also, do you prefer an electrical type or capillary?
dbarton291
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
For a temp sensor, you want to install the sending unit in the "to cooler" line at the transmission. That's also known as converter out. That is where the oil is its hottest.
The temp sensor used by the control system is in the sump. Its readings will be cooler than the temperatures generated at converter out.
Electrical is the way to go. Definitely.
For a temp sensor, you want to install the sending unit in the "to cooler" line at the transmission. That's also known as converter out. That is where the oil is its hottest.
The temp sensor used by the control system is in the sump. Its readings will be cooler than the temperatures generated at converter out.
Electrical is the way to go. Definitely.
Triple E
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
dbarton; I found the temp. range, 180 - 220 F. There is a "plug assembly, shipping, SAE 16" next to a "plug assembly, pressure tap". This is on, what the book calls, "Integral Sump Cooler". Would the SAE 16 plug location be the right place for the temperature sensor? If I remember right, the sensor should be in contact with the fluid to get the actual temperature. -Steve
dbarton; I found the temp. range, 180 - 220 F. There is a "plug assembly, shipping, SAE 16" next to a "plug assembly, pressure tap". This is on, what the book calls, "Integral Sump Cooler". Would the SAE 16 plug location be the right place for the temperature sensor? If I remember right, the sensor should be in contact with the fluid to get the actual temperature. -Steve
Triple E
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
Well it warmed up enough to spend some time under the MH. With my belly and winter clothes made it hard to climb under. So today I was able to see what I have. There is already a sensor Tee-ed into the cooling hose where you said it should be. I think this is the HOT temp. switch to my instrument panel. It appears that all I have to do is take out the Tee and replace with a Cross and mission will be accomplished.
Thank you dbarton with all of you help. I appreciated all of you input. :approve:
-Steve
Well it warmed up enough to spend some time under the MH. With my belly and winter clothes made it hard to climb under. So today I was able to see what I have. There is already a sensor Tee-ed into the cooling hose where you said it should be. I think this is the HOT temp. switch to my instrument panel. It appears that all I have to do is take out the Tee and replace with a Cross and mission will be accomplished.
Thank you dbarton with all of you help. I appreciated all of you input. :approve:
-Steve
dbarton291
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
Make doubly sure this is in the to cooler and not the from cooler line. OEMs don't always locate that sensor in the to cooler line for reasons I don't always agree with. Also, do you have an output retarder on this transmission?
Make doubly sure this is in the to cooler and not the from cooler line. OEMs don't always locate that sensor in the to cooler line for reasons I don't always agree with. Also, do you have an output retarder on this transmission?
dbarton291
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
180 - 220 is the sump temp normal range, not to cooler. Unless this MH is very new, it will probably not have an integral sump cooler.
For to cooler temps, the max is 300F. After 300F, trans fluid starts to break down. Transynd is more tolerant than most, but heat is still its enemy. For retarders, 300 is still max, but those are allowed to go to 330 intermittently during retarder apply.
180 - 220 is the sump temp normal range, not to cooler. Unless this MH is very new, it will probably not have an integral sump cooler.
For to cooler temps, the max is 300F. After 300F, trans fluid starts to break down. Transynd is more tolerant than most, but heat is still its enemy. For retarders, 300 is still max, but those are allowed to go to 330 intermittently during retarder apply.
Triple E
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
I have a 1997 Triple E Empress on a 1996 Freightliner chassie. So I assume the Allison is a 1996 model.
Now I will do my best to try explain the location of the temp sensor. If the Torque Converter is facing North, this temp sensor is on the West. Opposite of the Name Plate. The hose is coming form the radiator going into the transmission and back to the radiator. The temp sensor is inline with this hose entering the cooler on the West side.
From the drawing that I have I do not think I have a Retarder, but, since I do not know what a retarder is, I am not sure. From the drawing's it appears that the Retarder add about six inches to the transmission and I do not have this extra length.
The book says that the Sump temp should be 160 - 200 degrees F and the Converter-out temp should be 180 - 220 degress F. Will the temp. going in to the cooler be different than the Convertor? Thank again, -Steve
I have a 1997 Triple E Empress on a 1996 Freightliner chassie. So I assume the Allison is a 1996 model.
Now I will do my best to try explain the location of the temp sensor. If the Torque Converter is facing North, this temp sensor is on the West. Opposite of the Name Plate. The hose is coming form the radiator going into the transmission and back to the radiator. The temp sensor is inline with this hose entering the cooler on the West side.
From the drawing that I have I do not think I have a Retarder, but, since I do not know what a retarder is, I am not sure. From the drawing's it appears that the Retarder add about six inches to the transmission and I do not have this extra length.
The book says that the Sump temp should be 160 - 200 degrees F and the Converter-out temp should be 180 - 220 degress F. Will the temp. going in to the cooler be different than the Convertor? Thank again, -Steve
Triple E
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
I wish I could edit the above comment but it is to late. I am going to try to explain better.
If you are looking at the back of the Rear Cover assembly, directly under this cover are to ports, side by side, which is the cooler ports. The hose, with the sensor, is coming from the radiator and is mounted to the port on the left. So the path is radiator, hose, Tee w/sensor, cooling port. The port on the right is the return line back to the radiator.
The reason I say the cooling port is on the left is because of the manual that I have. "To Cooler" on the left "From Cooler" on the right. I cannot find any markings on the unit.
No, I do not have a Retarder. If I had studied my service manual a litter harder I could have figured this out.
I hope this helps with your questions. Thanks, -Steve
I wish I could edit the above comment but it is to late. I am going to try to explain better.
If you are looking at the back of the Rear Cover assembly, directly under this cover are to ports, side by side, which is the cooler ports. The hose, with the sensor, is coming from the radiator and is mounted to the port on the left. So the path is radiator, hose, Tee w/sensor, cooling port. The port on the right is the return line back to the radiator.
The reason I say the cooling port is on the left is because of the manual that I have. "To Cooler" on the left "From Cooler" on the right. I cannot find any markings on the unit.
No, I do not have a Retarder. If I had studied my service manual a litter harder I could have figured this out.
I hope this helps with your questions. Thanks, -Steve
dbarton291
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
Okay if to cooler is on the left and from cooler is on the right, and the sensor is on the left, the flow is trans, sensor, hose, cooler, hose, back to trans. That means the sensor is in the to cooler port which is good.
Different vehicles run slightly lower or higher of the normal sump temp listed in the book. The maximums are 250 in the sump and 300 to the cooler.
If you look closely at the cooler ports on the back of the transmission, you'll see two "V"s cast into the manifold the ports are in. Notice the direction the base of each V is pointing. That's the direction of the oil flow. If the port on the left is to cooler, the V cast in it will be point out of the transmission. Opposite for from cooler. Sneaky, huh.
Okay if to cooler is on the left and from cooler is on the right, and the sensor is on the left, the flow is trans, sensor, hose, cooler, hose, back to trans. That means the sensor is in the to cooler port which is good.
Different vehicles run slightly lower or higher of the normal sump temp listed in the book. The maximums are 250 in the sump and 300 to the cooler.
If you look closely at the cooler ports on the back of the transmission, you'll see two "V"s cast into the manifold the ports are in. Notice the direction the base of each V is pointing. That's the direction of the oil flow. If the port on the left is to cooler, the V cast in it will be point out of the transmission. Opposite for from cooler. Sneaky, huh.
Triple E
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
DUH!!!! I am stupid. I won't tell you how stupid but stupid. Thanks for turning on the light in my head. I had in my head that the cooler was part of the transmission not the cooler at the radiator. Now I just told you how stupid. :dead:
I owe you db. Thanks :approve:
-Steve
DUH!!!! I am stupid. I won't tell you how stupid but stupid. Thanks for turning on the light in my head. I had in my head that the cooler was part of the transmission not the cooler at the radiator. Now I just told you how stupid. :dead:
I owe you db. Thanks :approve:
-Steve
dbarton291
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
Nah, you're just learnin.
Nah, you're just learnin.
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
I have a problem with my Allison V730 transmission. It starts out running fine and shifting the way it is supposed to but after it seems to warm up (after 50 or 60 miles) it drops back to 2nd gear and I can't go over 50 miles an hour. It can be helped by letting off the accelerator. The bus is kowned by a Gospel Group and we can find no one in our area to tell what is wrong. We have replaced the Modulator valve but no help.
I have a problem with my Allison V730 transmission. It starts out running fine and shifting the way it is supposed to but after it seems to warm up (after 50 or 60 miles) it drops back to 2nd gear and I can't go over 50 miles an hour. It can be helped by letting off the accelerator. The bus is kowned by a Gospel Group and we can find no one in our area to tell what is wrong. We have replaced the Modulator valve but no help.
dbarton291
Senior Member
RE: Allison Transmission Questions
The V730 was modified at one time to include a low oil sensor. After the trans warms up, a bimetal strip bends and allows a steam of oil to inhibit the 2-3 shift. I would check the oil first and calibrate the dipstick. If that's not it, I'd drop the pan and inspect the sensor itself to see if anything looks out of sorts.
Another possibility is the trans governor pressure may have a problem at operating temperature.
Is the engine making power and full load RPM? If engine power or RPM is not up to snuff, the bus won't make enough oomph to maintain third. Unless this trans is real old, the 2-3 shift is not modulated.
Just some ideas to get you started.
The V730 was modified at one time to include a low oil sensor. After the trans warms up, a bimetal strip bends and allows a steam of oil to inhibit the 2-3 shift. I would check the oil first and calibrate the dipstick. If that's not it, I'd drop the pan and inspect the sensor itself to see if anything looks out of sorts.
Another possibility is the trans governor pressure may have a problem at operating temperature.
Is the engine making power and full load RPM? If engine power or RPM is not up to snuff, the bus won't make enough oomph to maintain third. Unless this trans is real old, the 2-3 shift is not modulated.
Just some ideas to get you started.